Talk: Damage over time

I'm not sure whether health degeneration triggers effects that are caused by "taking damage". Anyone? --Tetris L 01:41, 13 Aug 2005 (EST)

Degen does not count as damage. --Fyren 03:49, 13 Aug 2005 (EST)

It does according to Master of Damage in Isle of the Nameless 84.26.132.106 01:04, 23 May 2008 (UTC)

He's the exception, not the rule. He's programmed to record all health lost, not just direct damage. Things like Reversal of Fortune don't trigger on degen, that's why it's not damage.

And yay for responding to 2 1/2 year old conversations. --Macros 01:49, 23 May 2008 (UTC)

category/quick reference

I was just wondering, isn't there a category/quick reference for DoT skills? If there isn't, I think it would be helpfull if made, but if it already exists, there's a bunch of skills that should have it listed on their page. --El_Nazgir 17:02, 19 January 2009 (UTC)

There's Direct DoT AoE skills quick reference, but it doesn't cover non-AoE skills (Seeping Wound e.g.) or non-direct (whatever that means), so a full DoT QR would probably be useful. —Dr Ishmael 17:38, 19 January 2009 (UTC)

I think non-direct would be Incendiary Bonds, since it has a timer. Same goes for, say, Destructive Was Glaive (somewhat) and Destruction, I guess. Otoh, they aren't DoT. I can't think of ANY indirect DoT in that manner. And I have no idea what else it would be. --- -- (contribs) (talk) 17:49, 19 January 2009 (UTC)

Ah, right, I should've realized that - direct means the damage is dealt (or starts to be dealt) immediately when the skill is activated. In that case, traps would be indirect, wouldn't they? Dust and Flame trap are listed on the Direct DoT QR. —Dr Ishmael 17:59, 19 January 2009 (UTC)

Oh, right, Traps. Yeah, those would be indirect in the example above. *Note: Not every trap is DoT + Spike Trap is missing, since it has 2 pulses.* Assuming it is what the original creator of the category had in mind :P --- -- (contribs) (talk) 18:05, 19 January 2009 (UTC)

Well, actually, that was kinda the QR I was looking for when I wrote this, but I seemed to have completely forgot (or something) that there are non-AoE DoT's too, like most of the ones you listed.--El_Nazgir 18:11, 19 January 2009 (UTC)

Update?

This is one thing I feel I should probably run past people before fiddling with. I remember somebody calling health degen "damage over time". That person was new to the game, and I spent half an Alliance Battle trying to explain that health degen wasn't damage per se, because they didn't realize this. This story is around nine months old, now.

That's it. The one and only time I remember someone referring to degen as damage over time; and they'd no clue what they were talking about. I also think as an educational tool, we should avoid promoting bad practises, e.g., calling something damage over time when it isn't damage at all. It's borderline incorrect and potentially confusing to newer players. Is it okay with everyone if I tweak that bit slightly, or is health degen often referred to as damage in your experience? In my experience it's normally either "degen", "health degen" or "that fucking mesmer!" :P A F K When Needed 12:34, January 5, 2010 (UTC)

Go ahead and point out the difference. I think the main description should be actual damage, but then point out that health degeneration/health loss/life steal also acts like damage. --JonTheMon 15:04, January 5, 2010 (UTC)

(edit conflict) Holy crap, that's stupid. I can't believe it's been like this for so long - I would've changed it if I'd known. Since you've already volunteered, though, I'll let you take first stab at it. Put health degen under "Related articles" stating the difference. —Dr Ishmael 15:08, January 5, 2010 (UTC)

What the... consensus agreeing with me o.O Hmmm... this feels pleasant, but somewhat alien. A F K When Needed 15:26, January 5, 2010 (UTC)

Meh, I gave it a shot. A F K When Needed 15:43, January 5, 2010 (UTC)

Good start, I cleaned it up a bit. Glossary entries really shouldn't be loaded down with examples, unless they are being used to clarify a point (like the examples of triggered-damage skills).

While updating the qr page, I scanned through all the skills for all professions, but I didn't see any DoT skills that weren't AoE. Shatterstone, Weaken Knees, Seeping Wound, and Shameful Fear might qualify, but I'm not sure they're truly DoT. Shatterstone deals the second packet when the hex ends, not necessarily after 3 seconds, and the others require a trigger (moving or condition) to deal the DoT. —Dr Ishmael 18:18, January 5, 2010 (UTC)

Removing SStone means the second damage packet doesn't hit; it has to end naturally. --- -- (contribs) (talk) 18:30, January 5, 2010 (UTC)

Also: Glimmering Mark and Illusion of Pain.--El_Nazgir 18:30, January 5, 2010 (UTC)

@Viper: According to the notes, the second damage hits when it ends, whether it's removed early or not. Of course, the behavior may have been changed without anyone fixing the note.

@Naz: Illusion of Pain: I should've known there was a reason I "missed" that the first time. Glimmering Mark: that is a true non-AoE DoT skill. Still, would you say the others count?

Since there are so few non-AoE DoT skills, should we generalize the DoTAoE qr to a simple DoT qr? I think that would be reasonable. —Dr Ishmael 19:32, January 5, 2010 (UTC)

Phew, I was slightly concerned I'd be asked to justify that bit. :P

imo Glimmering counts, IoP does but that's getting nerfed, possibly this week, so that's not worth adding to an article when we don't know how they're changing it

I'd argue Shatterstone definitely counts, and I suppose Seeping Wound does. The rest depend on your definition. A F K When Needed 19:50, January 5, 2010 (UTC)

Or it changed without me noticing :P You online at the moment? --- -- (contribs) (talk) 20:36, January 5, 2010 (UTC)

Well, if SW counts with its condition conditional, then WK and SF should count with their movement conditional. That makes 6 (for now) non-AoE DoT skills. Anyone else agree with generalizing the qr? —Dr Ishmael 21:59, January 5, 2010 (UTC)

Fine by me. I don't see why not to include non-AoE in the first place. --- -- (contribs) (talk) 22:07, January 5, 2010 (UTC)

Same.--El_Nazgir 14:48, January 6, 2010 (UTC)

Okee dokee. I moved the page, and I think I got every skill that was mentioned. —Dr Ishmael 14:59, January 6, 2010 (UTC)

lol, SW was a typo X.X

I think it was a lucky mistake, though. Because surely needing a trigger doesn't mean Empathy is no longer a spell? Poor example, but you get the idea... imo skills with triggers still count A F K When Needed 12:43, January 9, 2010 (UTC)

So PI is a DoT, huh. I always used it as a nuke; ima doin' it wrong. Btw, it has little to do with Empathy being a spell. --- -- (contribs) (talk) 13:32, January 9, 2010 (UTC)

That was an example. A better one may be the fact that there's no Trigger type of skill. A F K When Needed 14:27, January 13, 2010 (UTC)